Episode 15: (22 BBY) Mace Windu Comics #2-5

This is the best part of this podcast. Talking about it has made me not like it more.

Right! We're meeting in the middle, Jon.

You're hot, I'm cold. We stir it up and we come out to medium.

Lukewarm.

A blind Jedi is the only one who can see the truth.

Or maybe he's just a traitorous jerk.

And the Jedi A-Team take down a mercenary droid who wants credits for some reason.

Today we finish issues 2 through 5 of Mace Windu on this edition of the 11 Parsecs Podcast.

Hello and welcome to episode 15 of the 11 Parsecs Podcast.

My name is Eric, I'm joined by my good buddy Jon.

Hello.

And today we are discussing Mace Windu, the comic series, or episode, I shouldn't say episodes, comics 2 through 5.

These are the final four comics of the comic arc.

There were five comics in that arc.

This was produced in 2017, written by Matt Owens and drawn by Dennis Cohen and Edgar Salazar.

First and foremost, Jon, as we do every podcast.

Yeah.

What are you drinking?

Oh, what am I drinking? OK.

I am drinking, tonight I'm having Creature Comfort's Crescendo.

Crescendo Hazy IPA.

Alright. Atlanta brewery, I like it, I like it.

Or sorry, no, Athens brewery.

Athens, technically.

Athens, Georgia brewery.

Forgot about that, sorry.

It's really good, it's really, really good.

It's quite pricey, mind you, but it's quite good, quite tasty.

Tonight I am drinking an in-shore slam.

I sound like one of those Uber Eats commercial.

Yeah, exactly. Uber Eats commercial.

Tonight I'm drinking an in-shore slam IPA by Coastal Empire Brewing from Savannah, Georgia.

I'm keeping it in-state.

Basically what I've been doing these last couple of weeks is anytime I buy a new six-pack,

or something I haven't drank before, I save one off.

So I've got this endless supply.

And I'm trying to choose the Georgia breweries first.

But then eventually we're going to get up to Colorado, California, that kind of stuff.

I was in Iowa like a podcast or two ago.

It was the last podcast I believe you were in Iowa.

Yeah, OK.

But you know, we venture out when we can.

When the waves aren't bad, the COVID.

When I am so moved.

Yeah, when we are so moved, we travel.

When we hit the London West.

But I have a soft spot for the local.

Yeah, agreed. I think we both do.

Alright, are you ready to pop? Because I'm ready to get some beer.

I'm ready, yeah, let's do it.

That's a 3, 2, 1, pop it.

Are you drinking a bottle or are you drinking a...

It's a Tallboy.

Oh, nice.

Yeah, that Toppling Goliath that we had, I think it was two podcasts ago that you had?

Or maybe it was three podcasts ago.

They all seem to be Tallboys. I like that.

I like that we're starting to... Don't get me wrong, it ends up being four beers and it ends up being like 16 bucks.

But, yeah, and that's a problem. I agree that's a problem.

But, that being said, they are a lot of beer.

You know, I mean...

Yeah, if you're going to go with a 4-pack, you have to be the Talls.

Exactly, that's what I was going to say.

Because I see more and more at our local bottle shop, I see more and more 4-packs of bottles.

And I'm like, no man, there's Tallboys standing right next to you.

I'm going with the Tallboy that I have a drink for.

Yeah, yeah, the 4-pack of bottles, the only way I'm doing that is if it's from Belgium.

Yeah, or it could be like something like super special, like a, you know, like an end of the year holiday Uber IPA, you know, like a quad or something like that.

I might go that way, but yeah, it's going to be really tough to compete.

Yeah. All right, you ready to sip? I need some.

Oh, yeah, I'm waiting for my head to go down.

That's good. That's very good. I've not had this before. It's very good.

I bought the 6-pack today, specifically for this podcast.

Nice.

Yeah, I was kind of happy I found something that I hadn't had before from Georgia.

Okay, as we were talking about.

I've never heard of Crescendo, just saw it, really good. Anyway, moving on.

I don't think I've had Crescendo, now that I think about it. I've had a lot of their brews.

Are there hit or miss for me, Creature Comforts?

Some of them are like, man, oh yeah, like Tropicana and stuff, I'm like, oh, it's great.

And then other ones like Athena, I'm just like, ooh, not sure about this.

Maybe it's just not my thing.

Yeah.

All right, Mace Windu, written by Matt Owens, drawn by Dennis Cowan, Edgar Salazar.

Five issues in the series, come out 2017, late part of 2017.

I think it started in August and wrapped up by December.

Which, if I remember, was kind of a drought for comics at that point.

Like, I remember this being a pretty big series, and I was really excited about it.

On the last podcast, oh, let me give a quick shout out to how this podcast works.

So, right now we are on 22 BBY.

Basically what we are doing is we have a list that was created in December of last year.

And we are progressing through chronological order, chronological BBY order,

every single piece of Star Wars canon, books, movies, audio dramas, TV shows, everything.

But we're trying to do it in progressive BBY order, so we start from the very beginning.

Right now we are on podcast 15, we're a little bit into the list.

There's a lot more of the list to go.

But we also will call Audible sometimes for new stuff that comes out.

John and I have just started reading A Lot of the Jedi by Charles Sewell.

That will probably be our first author.

Both get done reading that, but we're sticking to this list.

The list is posted on our website at 11 parsecs.com.

Just go to the right hand side.

Look at the list click on it and you will see the exact order in which we're going to be reading consuming listening to all these different pieces of Canon.

Now in saying that be sure that you also understand that we are completely chock-full of spoilers.

Most of the stuff that we're going to be encountering Light of the Jedi excluded because it just came out is going to be years old.

So this was this stuff came out in 2017.

We're looking at three or four years old.

There were four years old.

We're chock-full of spoilers.

We don't hold back on anything.

So if you do plan on reading what we're discussing today, which is the last issues of the Mace Windu comic five-part comic series that came out in 2017 don't listen to us and we would love you as a listener and please check back in on the next couple things that we have in chronological order, but we are total total spoilers.

So please be aware of that before you start to get into this podcast and with that being said John we discussed issue one of Mace Windu on the last podcast.

You had a pretty strong opinion.

I remember being I kind of like this comic a lot.

You had a very strong opinion about the art and that's what was keeping back from enjoying the first comic.

Did that get any better and no, no, it does not.

So that's because I asked you specifically for a number one through a hundred what you would rate the first comic and you never gave me an actual number.

I don't think but I could tell it was hovering pretty low because of the art is pretty pretty darn low.

Now that we have the full story.

Oh, it's so low.

It's such a low number.

What?

Oh, okay.

So now we really got to discuss something here.

So you didn't even like the story in the end.

I don't I don't really like any of this.

Wow.

Really?

Wow.

Okay.

Okay.

All right.

It doesn't make any sense.

There's like this contrived, you know in fighting.

No, don't don't like it.

Anti-climactic the whole I mean, I'm just I'm sleeping head over here, but there's nothing satisfying.

About let's talk let's talk about this the second comic the second comic was definitely by far probably the worst in the series for me.

If you remember at the end of the last podcast in the end of the first comic we got introduced to adw for who was this mercenary you didn't know anything about him at the the splash page the last page that we got of the first comic but you just see him standing there full page, you know, like I'm ready to go blah blah blah blah blah.

So the second comic kind of gives a little bit more of his backstory.

He starts talking more about the Jedi starts talking.

He has a encounter with Mace in the comic kit.

Fisto isn't giving a crap about anything.

He's ready to bust some bust some stuff up.

The second comic is like I said, it's probably the slowest of all of them, but it definitely introduces adw for to Mace that first fight that they have.

How do you feel about the the uber capitalistic robot?

It just it just doesn't make any sense.

I don't get it.

I really don't I kind of had the same thoughts with the what is was the the bounty hunter in Mandalorian that robot, you know, he goes through a whole character arc.

Yeah, but but originally it's like I don't what's the point?

Why is a robot care about credits?

I don't get it.

I've always wondered if this is a something that he was sorry something that he was programmed to what clearly well, I don't know or is it or is it something that he's developed over time like he actually

understands the fact that credits equal power and why does he care?

I don't know.

I just have an issue with the fundamental that just just just a concept is really what it is.

I just have an issue with it.

It doesn't click with me.

It doesn't it doesn't ring true.

Why would somebody program a robot like this?

I don't think we've seen in Star Wars.

Have we seen like like robots or droids developing evolving?

You know, you said maybe he grew into this.

Maybe he taught himself.

Basically.

I don't think we've seen that.

Yeah, you're designed.

You say this is what you do.

Yeah, you're saying like the almost the AI hasn't evolved.

Has it chosen to evolve?

I mean, we've always just seen regular Androids.

Yeah, now that you say that he is kind of a newly archetype for Androids.

I guess you could say in the Star Wars universe.

I'm trying to think of other Androids that we've seen at least up until now.

I mean, you know, we don't get stuff away or at least in maybe the movies that we see that have a little bit of feeling.

You can see 3PO at the end of the Skywalker arc, you know, I just want to take a look.

Let's look at my friends.

You know, there's a little bit of emotion there.

But yeah, I think you're right.

Like the holy contrived moment.

Yeah.

Okay, let's jump to that.

All right.

We're not we're not jumping that far yet.

Okay, so but but I see what you mean about emotion, pure emotion.

But even later on the comic series, Mace Windu says, I know you're not able or capable of emotions.

And he's like, well, I can set my tone, though, you know, and it's kind of like, yeah, I guess it was trying to have it trying to have it, you know, all the different

different ways.

And I just don't I don't like it.

Okay, so there is there is a neat thing that we've touched on, especially Williams touched on whenever we have some of the movie podcast.

There's a there's a line that I wrote down specifically that he tells Mace.

It says imposing your own moral compass on the galaxy is the height of ego.

Yeah.

It's a good line.

I think it's a good line.

I think it's a good way to convey, I don't want to say what he feels because he's not

feeling anything, but I think it's a idea that the Jedi don't hear enough at this point.

Thoughts?

I would say the one thing this comic does is highlight the inherent contradiction of

being a Jedi.

Yeah, agreed.

I think it does a very good job of that.

Now, well, let's explore that.

So there's an inherent contradiction in the concept of a Jedi and a Jedi Order and what

they're supposed to do.

Whose fault is that?

Is that Lucas?

Did Lucas just, you know, again, he had this original tight little story and he didn't

really think it through.

Or he didn't expect that it would expand so much.

Yeah.

So, anytime you have people who are dedicated to, not just dedicated to people, but dedicated

to not just dedicated to peace.

So that's what they claim.

They're dedicated to enforcing the peace.

They're dedicated to order.

Okay, sure.

Which is a very, very different thing, right?

It's not peace per se.

It's not peace.

And that's what the what's his face flips out over, which again, did not ring true at

all to me.

It is just too shallow.

See, I thought it was pretty good.

Like so, so WD-40 goes kind of like, you're not the, the, the leaders that you think you

are, but then you have the whole Prostitutes arc.

And I think that that's the guy I'm talking about.

Oh, okay.

Sorry.

Sorry.

I did not.

Yeah.

This little contrived mid, mid stream fight to interject some, some drama.

I did didn't like it.

I kind of do.

I like prostitutes as character.

I really do.

Like, so we'll be seeing a lot more of him, but.

Okay.

So if you like his character, is he correct?

It could be the fact that I've seen more of him and that's why I like the characters.

I want to be honest about it, but I enjoy the fact that he's blind, but yet he see,

I mean, that's, that's, that's his character is just that he can't see, but he can't see,

but now he can, I can see what the Jedi are doing.

It's, it's an interesting, and we talked about this with William on the last podcast.

I mean, it's almost like you're creating, you really feel like at this point you can

attain peace by going to war and, and don't get me wrong.

I mean, at this point, what is the alternative?

What they have to do?

I get that.

What is the alternative?

That's what really ticks me off about it is what, what are you proposing?

Just, just drop your lightsabers and Kumbaya hug.

Yeah.

Really?

Is that, is that okay?

Since you, since you, you, you, you like the character, you like where he's going.

I do.

You like what he said.

Take a moment to articulate his position.

So, his position is given away, and I think it's comic three, maybe comic four, where

they are trying to save the people of Hisis, I think is the name of it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Something like that.

Yeah.

Hisrich.

Hisrich.

They're trying to save the people of Hisrich, and Kit Fisto, who, again, is one of my favorite

Jedi, is like, all right, let's chase after these guys.

Let's go tear them down.

He's like, no, man, we got to save all these people.

There's a city that just had their roof collapse on them.

And then you see Kit Fisto just kind of pause for a second and be like, yeah, you're right.

And then they go try to help the people.

And it's just kind of like a, if you're a Jedi, which decision do you make?

If you're a true Jedi that's sticking to the standards, which decision do you make?

Do you chase after the villains so that you can stop this from tons of other people?

Or do you go help these, you know, however many people are in need immediately and solidify

what you think your beliefs are?

I mean, it's a tough choice.

It's a conundrum.

I don't, okay, see, I'm a little confused, because I didn't see the choice that you're

talking about.

They come across the cavern full of all the dead bodies.

Right?

Hold on one second.

I'm going to look it up.

It's fun if I do.

Yeah, I've pulled up the panel here.

64.

They find the dead bodies.

And that's when Prosset loses it.

He's like, all this death.

We should have, we were supposed to protect them.

Okay.

You're talking about after the Militon?

Yeah.

Yeah, so there's a panel where after this creature that comes out, because the, what

is the Federation at this point?

It has already started pulling up these big magic McGloey mushrooms, which has created

a bad situation for the people that live down in the city that they visited.

This big creature comes because he's not afraid of the light anymore.

And he just tears it up and they kill him, you know, pretty quick.

But then Prosset sees all these dead guys over on the side.

And he's kind of like, you know, what are we doing this for?

We're just bringing, you know, hell to all these people and all these planets on the

outer rim when we don't need to.

And you're right.

I mean, there is a little bit of a Kit Fisto being like, well, we got to look at the bigger

picture.

But besides these, the specific planet, you know, do you save the many or do you save

the few?

You're really, really being charitable to what's his face, the blind guy.

So he says clearly, right, the conflict extended its reach.

Malevolent tendrils to a planet that had nothing to do with this war and these people have paid the ultimate price for it.

How is this us keeping the peace? How is this the Jedi? How is this the fault of the Jedi?

What did the Jedi do to make them come to this planet and lay waste to it?

Well, so I think Prosset's getting a

small light inside his head saying and he believes and again the comic never really resolves this this argument that

Prosset Dibbs has with Mace Windu. He thinks that Mace honestly knows

what the Empire is doing here and what exactly they are there for. They're there to secure this energy

resource and I think that's what Prosset honestly believes. Whether he's right or wrong, the comic never answers.

But he's saying that Mace, you knew the entire time that we were coming here that the Empire needs this planet for the resource and

of course Mace Windu's like no, we came here because we knew the Empire was on this planet

and something must be up.

And that's the big that's the whole big catalyst for the fight scene.

I just I don't I don't see what sets Prosset off. I think he has figured out that

they are sent here to

specifically do the exact same thing that the Empire is doing at this point.

That they're just stop the the Separatists. That's the that's the question of the comic and the comic never answers that question.

It never does. Mace steadfastly whenever they're whenever they're having their argument and

eventually their lightsaber fight, Prosset Dibs a Jedi Master and Mace Windu a Jedi General Master, whatever they're called at this point,

go into a lightsaber fight.

Yeah, go into a lightsaber fight because Prosset is so mad at Mace Windu saying you knew the entire time we were sent here

that we were coming down here to see what they're trying to figure out so that we can get the resource for the Jedi and

the Resistance or the clones. And

and and Mace is like and to be fair again the comic never answers it Mace is like no no no no I didn't know this.

Well, you know I was sent here by Yoda to come down and maybe Yoda knows it.

But Mace steadfastly says I did not know that this is the reason that we were being sent here and

Prosset Dibs is just like you're you know, you're full of s***. I mean, I'm telling you right now

I realized you know long ago that this Jedi Order is not what it's cracked up to be.

We don't really reside on our principles.

We specifically reside on the fact that we need to win this war and I think that's what he's torn with and I think that

that the dead bodies after the Milodon attack is what turns him and he's just like no we knew the whole time what we were

coming here for.

Do you not get that drift?

Well, I am finding the the panels that you're talking about and I

will agree with you that the comic does not answer that question.

Yeah, agreed. It doesn't. It never answers whether Mace really knew what the mission was.

It leaves it up to the reader. Yeah, I have I have a touch more sympathy a touch more sympathy for Prosset

But I still think he's a jackass.

Yeah, I'm not saying he's gonna be a hero in any sense of the word future

But I am saying that I kind of understand a little bit better

even though I don't I don't know who I would side with whether like and I think that that's the the other two Jedi Kit

Fisto and Marissa like they're both just kind of like should we jump into this and I think Kit Fisto is pretty solidly on Mace

Windu's side. I think Marissa is probably solidly on Mace Windu's side, but

again, it's never really answered like

You know Mace

Where did he know does he know the whole time that they're being sent down here to figure out what's going on this planet?

Why it's resource happy and then make sure that that resource ends up under the

The the control, you know the Jedi the clones. I mean, you know, I don't it's a good question

I think that the writer does a really good job of bringing it up in a way that

You know that says we will never know then there's never a panel in the comic that answers it

so it's an interesting conundrum in my opinion because

Prostit dibs now is

Totally pissed off is is ready to leave the Jedi Order so much that he believes that that this is really just a you know

a scouting mission for a war

Resource. So are you allowed to leave the Jedi Order or not?

You know, it's very interesting because like in the last couple of panels of the last comic

Whenever he's being quote-unquote sentenced, you know, you can definitely tell that he's like, well, he wants to die a martyr and

The Jedi Council is ready to do that Yoda's ready to do that and then you know, and then Mace windows

Because he took up he he took up he fought with with Mace in the panels before the fight

He says I'm going to leave and what does Mace say to that? I

Don't remember what does he say? I will not hesitate to hunt you down. Yeah, that's right. I forgot that. Yeah

He does say that me any it has a flashback the next thing. Yeah. Yeah, they should other people

Right. I thought you could I'm that we've seen that in the stories we've done so far because they're out there on a bit

Okay, so there's like real military consequences here. I don't know going a wall soldier. They're acting all generalish

I don't know. I don't you know, I don't know what the

Do the Jedi like fundamentals say that when we're at war you can't leave? I mean, you know, I don't know I

I'd...

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Yeah, the simple answer, the simple read of it is that it's

just contradictory. And maybe Mace thinks that this guy, as we

discussed the last time we talked about, can you just

leave? Maybe Mace thinks that he's too powerful. He can't just

leave. So I won't let you.

Yeah, I did not take it that way. But you're saying that this

guy knows, not knows too much, but is so advanced that we don't

want him to leave.

It's either that or Mace is just kind of losing his mind a little.

I never thought of it that way. I really never. I thought of it

as like, we're on a mission. I need you. If you turn your back

on me.

It's one of those things. Once you reach like level seven, you

know, theta, you can't just walk away.

Or can you? I don't know. I don't know. But all right. So

what was your opinion of the flashback where we have Mace

Windu as a young apprentice and we have Sislin Mir, I think was

his Jedi Master. And they chased down an imposter who, let's

be honest, if you're going to do anything in this galaxy,

impersonating a Jedi Master is probably like the impersonating

a police officer. Like, what do you hope to gain?

Like it's impersonating like Iron Man or something.

Yeah, like exactly. It's like, you're not going to get away

with it. You know, it's like, why would you even attempt to

do it? And then not only that, but there obviously was a Jedi

Master that you had to, I don't know, you never know what

happens to the Jedi Master that he takes over for.

Yeah, we don't know what happens to him.

So like, you don't think the Jedi are going to come after

you to see what's going on? They've lost communications with

their Jedi? And then now you're just going to, and let's be

honest, also, this planet is plagued by the Niffin Plague.

I mean, you're going to stake your kingship here? I mean,

like, that's what you want to do?

Con men look for the openings.

I understand that, Bruce.

They're soft targets. And they always think that they can

out-con. They think that they can get their way out of any

situation.

So just for the listeners that are trying to understand

what's going on, as soon as Prosset Dibs, so basically

Prosset Dibs has this Epiphany that we talked about whenever

they're fighting. Him and Kit Fisto are two in a separate

place. And then Mace Windu and Rissa are in another place

on this planet. And Kit Fisto and Prosset end up fighting

this huge monster, the Miladon, and then they see all these

dead bodies of the people that helped them earlier. They

built the city and all this other stuff. And they, you know,

Prosset has his breakdown, I guess you'd call it, where

he's just like, what are we doing this for, blah, blah, blah.

They all meet back up and he confronts Mace. And it's

like a I'm leaving kind of thing. And Mace is like, no,

you're not. And they go out. They start fighting. And

Kit Fisto is holding Rissa back. And it's a weird ending

of the comic, in my opinion, because then the beginning

of the next comic is a flashback to when Mace and his

Jedi Master Sissel and Mir are on a planet a long time

ago where there's a plague-ridden planet. The people are

dying a lot. There was a Jedi Master named Kez Vlaas who

was on this planet trying to take care of it or set up,

you know, spiritual places and just trying to help the

people. And this guy named Drools, who is just a weird

name, claims that he does something with the Jedi Master.

They never talk about that. But basically he sets up

and proclaims himself somewhat of a religious pariah,

I guess, type situation. And he sits on a throne and

just kind of like says, you're not giving enough, give

more, give more, give more. And the Jedi confront him,

which is a really poor plan, in my opinion, to begin

with. But regardless, we've established that the

comic tries to find his end wherever he can. And Mace

and his Jedi Master are forced to take this guy out.

Mace wants to kill the guy after he captures him.

And his Jedi Master, Mere, says no, he needs to go

be before the council and be judged. I thought it was

a weird flashback. I just felt forced a little bit,

you know what I mean? Force is a good word, yes.

Yeah, it was just kind of like if it had happened

maybe even earlier, maybe like in comic one or

something, I'd be like, okay, we're setting up some

stuff. We're setting up a little bit of the story.

But it just felt really weird being at the very

beginning of the third comic and then the first

third comic and then like literally the next panel

is him with Prasadibs.

Well, that's what they were trying to do is they

were trying to flip back and forth and show either

parallels or have the flashback provide a little

extra insight. And no, I don't see it doing that

at all. It doesn't. It's just story.

Yeah, and it's just like Mace has probably done

this a million times before. Like, I don't understand

why this one specific instance is supposed to set

back because this Drew's guy is a just terrible

low life person and you don't feel for him at all

as a character. And if Mace would have just whacked

his head off, I'd have been like, okay, you know.

But then like you have Prasadibs who is honestly

like, you know, I'm not saying he's right, but

from whatever his perspective is, he's like

pouring his heart out saying we're not doing the

right thing as Jedi, not Mace.

Luke Skywalker was a Jedi.

Luke Skywalker was a Jedi.

You know, with a fight with WD-40 is going to come down to in the end, you know, you're just kind of like, OK, well.

Again, that was very anticlimactic.

Just just not not much of a battle.

Yeah, that yeah, that's probably that's probably my biggest pet peeve about that battle is just that, like, I expected, like, I don't know, like 10 pages going back and forth.

Where Mace Windu is just like, you know, you're you're actually worried about him at some point.

No. Yeah.

You're not worried about him at all.

Like you're just like, yeah, where the droid has these secret weapons or he's got these really killer moves that he's learned because he's a, you know, a mercenary assassin or whatever.

But no, he's really got not nothing, not just a club and that's it.

And Mace doesn't really have to do anything special or clever or all.

He doesn't almost lose.

I mean, it's just in fact, it makes me wonder because he gets punched several times.

Yeah, I mean, Mace gets Mace gets punched.

Yeah.

By a metal robot guy.

That's gotta like break some bones.

Yeah, I agree.

So, but he but he doesn't.

So is he like force cushioning the blows?

I don't know.

That's a good question.

And also to the fate that he has in our red shirt Rissa for that thing to blow up above him.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

Yeah.

That was supposed to be the little like she was.

Yeah.

Well, yeah.

So it was almost like a way.

Yeah.

And then the not.

Yeah.

But the whole like she's brand new.

You know, he's trusting her to go do this one thing.

I didn't want to have to trust you on this, but you're going to have to do it.

You know, I.

You thought she was a red shirt.

You thought she was a red shirt for the beginning, didn't you?

Yes.

Yeah.

You thought she was going to die.

I remember you saying it.

And I remember.

She was going to die.

Yeah, that she wasn't going to die.

But I don't remember what she did.

But I guess she impressed me a little bit.

I'm eager to see if we see her anymore.

You should definitely see Kit Fisto.

And you'll definitely see Prasad Dibs.

But I wonder if we'll see Rissa anymore.

I agree.

Because I don't think that I rec.

I remember any other time that she's been in the comics that I've read now.

Clone Wars and all that kind of stuff.

We'll see.

I don't know.

They are.

They are building her up quite a bit.

They are.

Yeah.

She's the tinkerer.

Like she gets stuff done on the on the tinker front.

And it's almost.

No, not just that.

Not just that.

But when the when the sword fight is going on, because I mean, I know this.

When the sword fight is going on and she's she says, we shouldn't be fighting each other.

I mean, yeah.

Right.

Duh.

But Kim Fisto is a way to build her up, says you speak so wisely for someone so new.

Yeah.

Agreed.

That's freaking common sense.

What she just said.

And we shouldn't be fighting each other.

Her A-Team archetype, like the mechanic kind of person.

Like it's a little Anakin-esque.

You know what I mean?

Remember the Anakin in Obi-Wan comic we read earlier?

Where Anakin fixes up all the droids and all this other kind of stuff.

I get that vibe from her.

I do.

Again, though.

I don't remember this that anyone ever mentioning her out of the comics before, you know, coming from this point.

But maybe she's in The Clone Wars and stuff.

I don't know.

It's interesting.

What did you think of the head shooting off the droid guy?

I thought that was a lame thing at the end.

The head shoot.

Remind me what you're talking about.

Okay.

So WD-40, ADW4, whatever his name is.

At the very end of the battle, after Mace has like crammed his lightsaber into the droid's chest, he goes, you will pay, or Mace says, you will pay the ultimate price for choosing the wrong side.

And the droid says, you're a religious man, master.

Don't you believe in life after death?

And then the head shoots off the droid.

And I assume that it's going to kick in an afterburner and fly somewhere so that he can live again.

Oh, I actually misunderstood that.

I see it now.

I thought Mace went, Mace like threw him up into the sky.

Oh, no, no, no.

I think he's blasting off to go, you know, building a body somewhere.

See, that would have been cool.

And then Mace is kind of like, and then crushes it.

Right.

Yeah, no, I thought it was just Mace showing off.

I'm going to throw you up in the sky.

Yeah, agreed.

Well, OK, so I think that we're.

The escape head is way cooler.

Escape head is cool.

And I think that escape head leading to Mace destroying it is, I think we're on the same page, though, that in the end it's just Mace being a badass.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

But, you know, it was a weird thing to me.

Like, I'm like, do all these droids have like escape heads?

Can you fly off?

No, that's the kind of thing I was talking about.

We should have seen more of that kind of stuff.

Let me say this, if you're a droid, do you escape head at night and just kind of fly around the neighborhood and look at people?

Like do you stare into their windows and then escape head back to your body?

I mean, if I could do it, I would.

I mean, you know, it's kind of a neat trick to have.

They should have let, Mace should have reached out and not been able to do it.

That's how that should have happened.

Now that I understand what's going on, escape head.

You're saying that escape head should have escaped.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's a better ending.

Okay.

Yeah, I agree.

Like, where is this guy now?

Yeah.

Is he an escape head on like this really weird body?

Because, I mean, you got to know the scars on his head match the scars on his body because he's been doing this for so long as a merc.

But, you know, when he lands and has to pick a body, is he just kind of like, well, I didn't get my money because I didn't deliver my whatever.

It's a standard model.

You pick it off the rack and then he scars it up to make it look right.

So you think it's like the high schooler that's trying to acid wash their jeans or just kind of make it look right.

He goes and gets a brand new spanking body and then he just kind of hits it with some hammer and is like, oh, yeah, this is from whenever I was on Duggarball.

That's right.

Throw in the washer a little bit.

There you go.

I think people can still.

So we always used to laugh when I worked at a place that did fitness that the new shoes, the people at the beginning of the year who New Year's resolution,

of course, is to lose weight.

So they buy a brand new pair of shoes and they would come into the gyms and, you know, everybody called them new shoes.

And that's that's that's that's a neat name.

Yeah.

So it was kind of it's not it's not it wasn't derogatory at all because new shoes people needed services and these people provided services and, you know, everybody made money and it was part of the churn.

I like that.

But but yeah, but they would always talk about how some people were like kind of scuff up the new shoes.

So, of course, it looked like you were there, but you could definitely tell that that's not a natural scuff.

That's like, you know, it's not a worn in shoe.

It's just a shoe with like a bunch of like junk on it, you know.

So that's.

So if you do that, that means you must have gone.

You must have been a new shoe at some point and realized.

And then you said never again, never again.

Well, I'm going to fail going to the gym.

This is like your fourth.

Completely new shoes.

And I'm like, yeah, that's what every year you're like, God, I got to buy a new pair of shoes and they're going to call me new shoes.

Yeah. So I feel like that's what this guy's got to do with his new body.

If he got away, he didn't get away.

Mase destroyed it, but he should have gotten away.

If he did get away.

I'm sure it's like on his fourth body.

He's like, yeah, we got to scuff this thing up a little bit.

Going to make the ladies think that this is a real Merc.

Yep. Got it. Got to put on some parsecs here.

You can't just have it right off the rack.

Yeah. So the new head thing was neat.

I thought that our escape head thing was neat.

I thought that was kind of a neat way to to like have it.

I'm amazed that Mase was able to just reach up and destroy it very quickly.

So yeah, that was so amazing.

We do, of course, we know within the movies,

Samuel Jackson wanted him to be a badass, you know, so purple lightsaber, his own color lights.

You have this character.

It's funny that you have this Star Wars character that is built off a real human.

And has to follow these guidelines that like the real human set like that.

Don't get me wrong.

This comic's good.

I liked a lot more than you did.

But that being said, like, you can't not walk away from this comic being like,

not only is Mase the badass from a physical standpoint,

but then at the end he has this, you know,

kind of humble pie that he wants to let Prosset Dibs know that we're not going to kill you.

I've learned over time that we're going to make you work in a library.

Because that's the worst thing we can do to you is make you work in a library.

Seriously, what kind of message is that?

Go work in the library, you loser.

Yeah, I don't understand how working in the library like works.

Like, how does like that?

It's mean. He can't see. He can't read the books.

Oh, I know he can't. He can't find the book for you.

I mean, I get it. I mean, like, what does he do?

But still, I, but like, that's a, that's a, that's a him thing.

But I'm just saying like, is that like a punish?

Like, because we've read multiple comics where like the two,

whenever it was in the audio drama, Doku Jedi Lost,

it was Doku and Sephideus,

whenever they got in trouble for breaking into that one part of the library,

they had to work in the library for like the next like four weeks.

So like working in the library ranges from like stupid kid,

Harry Potter problems to like Prostit Dibs,

who pretty much was about to be killed by the Jedi Council.

And now he's working in the library. Like that's, that's his punishment.

I mean, you know, he's talking to all the, all the, the,

the semi bad kids being like, Hey man, we gotta get out of here.

So Mr. Mr. Critical of everything, what should his punishment have been?

So, well, so the original, based on the comic,

the original panel suggested that he was going to be killed.

I don't know what his punishment should have been.

I don't understand why the Jedi are just like, Hey,

you don't believe in what we do. We get that. You go. I mean, I don't know.

What do you think it should be? I have no idea. He did attack Mace Windu.

I mean, he did attack. Yeah, he did attack him. So, I mean, you can't, yeah,

you can't discount that. And I'm not saying like,

maybe if he would have walked away, but also he tried to kind of walk away.

And Mace is.

Yeah, and Mace is like, no you won't.

Right.

And I don't know what rules govern that because, and I don't think the Jedi should really either because, I mean, I'm sure probably with all the old or the newer Light of the Jedi books, we'll probably get into Jedis being in other wars.

But, you know, is there a code of conduct during wartime that is different than the Jedi code? I don't know.

Back in the Dooku Jedi Lost, they said that there was only 12 Jedi that had ever left the Order, I think, at that point.

But they were allowed to leave. That was my point earlier.

They were allowed to leave.

Yeah, agreed.

Why couldn't he leave?

Yeah, yeah. Mace kind of provoked him. And I understand that Mace needed him for this mission or what have you. And that's why he thought that he'd continue to stay on the mission.

But yeah, definitely I agree with you that Mace provoked him and he was just ready to go home. He didn't want to do this anymore. He didn't believe in it, you know.

So what do you do? Do you say, okay, well, here's your planet, go for it, you know.

Well, okay. So that gets back to the broad question of what is the purpose of punishment? Is it to rehabilitate or is it to just exact vengeance of society?

That's probably an age old philosophy question. I don't know.

Or is it simply to lock your ass away so we protect society from you?

Yeah, well, so and we've seen that too, again, with the Doku Jedi Lost book, they would lock certain people that had four visions in the Citadel.

Right.

And they wouldn't let them out. And that again brings up another question that I'm sure Prositibs is kind of like, we're locking people away just because of a certain Jedi power that they have?

Is that right? Are we able to do that?

Have we seen that in any of the canon, I guess I have to say so far, I guess we haven't, but I was about to ask a question I guess I'm not supposed to know the answer to.

But basically an insane Jedi, a psychopathic or sociopathic Jedi.

I do not know an exact instance in the future in which we will see that in any of the canon material, but I'm sure that has to be explored at some point.

Wouldn't that, I mean, think of somebody like a Hannibal as Jedi.

Yeah.

There's a story right there.

Yeah. And again, though, that's probably why we talked about, you know, on previous episodes to where they get them young, you know, like they don't, they won't accept you.

Anakin was the exception, you know, they won't accept you if you're not, you know, of X age and below just because they can't, they can't control that narrative at that point, you know?

Yeah. The question becomes like, is somebody like Hannibal like that from birth? You know, is it nature versus nature?

And they're training him up, you know, and developing his powers.

Yeah, he just goes ballistic.

Well, no, no, no, no, no. He's much more subversive, much more subtle.

Interesting.

Sociopaths can pass for normal. That's part of what makes them sociopathic.

Remember one of these characters, Jon.

Okay. That's cryptic.

It is cryptic, but we'll see them later.

It's that girl. I know it.

It's Risa.

Risa that's never the same from panel to panel.

None of them are the same from panel. I'm looking at them on the last.

So it's very funny that the last podcast we discussed it. And I think that I've just been reading comics for so long that I just, I'm fine with it. Like, my brain doesn't register it.

This is not the first comic we've read.

No.

I am not a comic book expert. This is not the first one we read, and none of them ever jumped out like this.

Agreed. I totally agree with that. I totally agree with you. The comics that we have read, the Anakin and Obi-Wan is probably some of the best art, in my opinion, in this series, or in this, in Star Wars comic book history.

Other than maybe Lando and some other comics.

Yeah, I agree. Like, as I was reading these, I was remembering your comments from the last podcast.

And there were definitely, so Mace changed all the time. Like, just all the time.

And then there's this one panel toward the very, very end where Mace is looking out the horizon.

He says, we have stuff coming up or something like that in the coming years or in the coming wars.

And it is like the worst drawn Ahsoka and like other stuff.

Like, it is like terrible. Like, you know, I was just kind of like, yeah, I think I think I was able to whenever I was reading it for fun, I was able to give it the pass just because I was like, hey, good story. Enjoyed it.

But yeah, after the last podcast, I definitely noticed a lot more, especially in the last comic.

I was just kind of like, oh, OK. All right. We'll end it like this.

Yep. It was annoying from beginning to end.

Agreed. Agreed. Yeah, it was it was.

I mean, I'm sorry. I'm not an artist. I can't do any better.

But so but part of it is just because the fact that the Anakin Nobi one series is so well drawn.

Like, I love I love the art of that series. Like it is. It is so amazing.

And I think that all the Age of Republics that we've read thus far are just very similar, like not similar to the Anakin Obi-Wan, but they're all very they're their own beast.

Like, they're all drawn very similarly. They're consistent for panel to panel.

This was the first one that kind of jumps around a little bit more. Yeah.

And once you once you said it, I didn't notice it. It just it keeps breaking me out of the story.

And it never broke me out of the story, even in the second reading.

Whenever I saw it, I was just like, OK, John's right about the panel.

And then I kept reading it, you know, but but still like I yeah, I get if you're if you're a fan of the series, I get it.

Early in reading comics you're probably just like, can't they keep it the same from page to page?

Well, I mean, it's like, okay, I finish reading one page and I go to the next page and I'm like, who the hell is... oh, that's Mace.

Yeah.

And also, I didn't notice a lot more too in Kit Fisto's face.

Yeah.

Like, from panel to panel I'd be like, and don't get me wrong, you know who Kit Fisto is, you know, based off...

A little more forgiving. He's not a human, so I'm more forgiving of that.

Yeah. Oh, okay, that's what you're saying. You're saying that it really bothered you with the humans.

Yeah.

You said Mace Windu's designed after an actual person.

Yeah.

So I know what that person looks like. It could not look like Samuel Jackson, and that's fine as long as it looked like the same person every time.

I will say that there were some kind of like... so the last couple panels where Yoda's talking... yeah.

Oh, yeah, there's one panel where Yoda looks... I can't even describe what he looks like there. An old man.

Well, he looks very...

Looks weird.

Yeah, agreed. He looks like Yoda from...

Looks like Bernie Sanders. That's what he looks like.

He looks like... he's got his mittens on.

Yeah, put some mittens on him.

Yeah, it... yeah. Yeah, I'll agree with you. I will... I will... I... on the last podcast I was kind of like, are you really bothered by that?

But now that you mentioned it to me I got bothered by it too a little bit. I'm able to read through it, but it was... I agree.

Also, Prasad Dibs toward the end too, like his little mask thing, like the Daredevil-esque mask thing was kind of weird.

Like it's like... it's like it's stuck to his head or something now at this point, but...

Right. Painted on.

All right, so overall, what do you give this series?

A three. A freaking three or a four.

Okay, so we... you are literally 67 below your lowest score.

I don't know. I... talking about it actually made me like it a little more. Escape Head, get some points for that.

See, this is the best part of this podcast. Talking about it has made me not like it more.

Right.

We're meeting in the middle, John. We're meeting in the middle.

You're hot, I'm cold. You know, we stir it up and we come out to medium...

Lukewarm.

Lukewarm, yeah. There you go.

All right, so out of a hundred, you didn't actually give me a score last time. I went back and listened to the audit.

You did not give me a score last time, so I felt that you were in the 60s maybe last time.

Yeah, I want to say 60-something.

I don't want words in your mouth.

No, no, that's where I was.

Where do you feel like you land after reading all five?

In the 60s. Low 60s. Low 60s. Yeah, low 60s.

Okay, okay. So low 60s. I have been brought down from what I probably would have said was an 80 to... 73, 74?

Okay.

Yeah, so...

Not that far apart.

I want to reflect on Prostit Dibs later on. Okay? I want us to get into some more content and reflect back on kind of the origin of him later on.

But I think that this book's... or this volume or these five issues' critical mission was to introduce the world to him.

And it's going to be interesting to see what your opinion is later on.

Fair enough.

If these did a good job.

Right.

And that's definitely a task, especially after rereading these.

Like, I've noticed that I agree with you about the art and some other stuff.

Yeah, it's good.

So thanks for joining us discussing the last five... I shouldn't say the last five.

The five issues of the Mace Windu series.

The last four is what we discussed on this podcast.

We're getting into some TV shows.

And I'm kind of excited about this.

So, so far, the first podcast was about Master and Apprentice.

The next couple of podcasts were about the Darth Maul comics, a bunch of Age of Republic Comics.

Then we got into Phantom Menace, which was our first movie podcast.

We then read the Obi-Wan and Anakin series, which we've referenced on this podcast before.

And that was a great comic book series.

I think we both enjoyed that.

Then we got into Queen's Shadow, which I think we were a little lukewarm on, the book itself.

But it was a well-written book.

Some more Age of Republic stuff.

Doku Jedi Lost, the audio drama.

Episode 2, Attack of the Clones.

And then now we are kind of done with comics for a little bit.

There's some Age of Republics coming up.

But I think for the next four or five podcasts, we are going to be reviewing Clone Wars episodes.

So, we, again, we're going by chronological order.

And on a list that's on our website, 11parsecs.com, and this chronological order that we found,

we are now going to be starting out with Season 2, Episode 16, Cat and Mouse.

And the second one that we're going to be watching for the next podcast is going to be Season 1, Episode 16, The Hidden Enemy.

So, just to make sure everybody's on the same page with us, we're not going to be watching The Clone Wars series in order as they were delivered to TV.

We are watching them in BBY order and in an order.

So, there's a lot of stuff that kind of happened around 22 BBY.

But this is an order that people feel like is the correct order for sequencing.

So, our next podcast, we're going to be reviewing two episodes of The Clone Wars.

And I'm kind of excited getting into the TV medium because we haven't watched anything yet on TV, John.

I have never seen the show, so I am very much looking forward to it.

Yeah. And I'm interested to see.

So I whenever I did watch the show and I probably watched the first two seasons, I

watched them in order as they came out.

So I'm kind of interested to see how these later shows, how we're watching them in

the beginning. Like what are they?

What story are they telling that we need to know for future episodes?

So I'm excited about it.

So again, Podcast 16 will be our next podcast.

We'll be watching season two, episode 16, Cat and Mouse of the Corn Lords and also

season one, episode 16, The Hidden Enemy.

And then we actually have the Corn Lords movie.

So until then, stay healthy and stay safe.

This is the 11 Parsecs podcast, episode 15.

If you enjoyed this podcast, please take a moment to subscribe and leave us a good

review. And be sure to check us out at 11parsecs.com and Discord.

I'm Jonathan Smith with the all seeing Eric Thompson.

Thank you for joining us.